Latest Posts by taliesin-the-bored - Page 2

Maelgwn is also important in the story of Taliesin, in an incident which doesn't leave him or Taliesin looking great and is Part 2 of my beef with men named Rhun. We do get an impression of Maelgwn as a patron of the arts but not necessarily a discerning one, though it may just be that he didn't have the good fortune to come across as talented a nuisance as Taliesin—he has 24 bards and none of them are very good, or if they are, they can't compare, since no one can. (They end up cursed to say nothing but "blwerm, blwerm" while Taliesin waxes poetic).

Someone once told me that after defecting from Arthur (Cullwch and Olwen plot point), Cai/Sir Kay became a leader in Maelgwn's army, but I am 99% certain there's no source for this and he made it up. All the same, it could be narratively interesting.

Maelgwn Gwynedd

(The lad himself. He looks how I look when confronted with any question at all. An expression of surprise mixed with apprehension. Note the tiny sword and orb.)

Entering the final stretch of 2024 with Arthuriana's favourite 'sodomitical grape' as Gildas called him. Seriously, Gildas has beef with him, almost as much as he has with dubious historical personage, King Arthur.

Not much is known about Maelgwn's reign considering how big of a guy he's become in the Arthurian mythos but what we do know of him is cool!!!

His great-granddad was Cunedda, who was the first king of Gwynedd, and from whom all others were descended. Cunedda had conquered Gwynedd after the fall of Roman Britain. His title, Wledig, is obscure and I won't go into it too much, but Cambrian Chronicles has done a video about it which I will link to at the end! It means 'of a country' but it's more likely it was an expression of some Roman title.

And his great-great-grandad was Edern - yes, the basis of THAT Edern in Welsh mythology - who was a romano-briton. Maelgwn's dad, Cadwallon Lawhir* (long-hand), was *maybe* king but there are also questions about that. Mainly from Gildas. He suggests that his brother, Owain Danwyn (White Tooth), was King and Cadwallon was his right-hand man - which perhaps would fit with him being the guy who drove the last of the Irish from Ynys Môn - and suggests that Maelgwn murdered his uncle to gain the throne. Peter Bartrum also suggests this but does caveat that the term used, 'avunculus' is normally only applied to a maternal uncle.

(Fun fact: Owain Danwyn was the father of St. Seriol who gave his name to Ynys Seriol otherwise referred to as Puffin Island in English. Maelgwn would later be buried here after he died of, well, we'll get to that.)

Regardless of who was and wasn't king, Maelgwn was the first to reap the rewards of his great-granddad's conquest.

He is normally regarded as the House of Aberffraw's founder from which all other kings of that line were descended. (Yes, including Law Lad, Hywel Dda) This would make them one of the oldest royal lineages until the English chopped off the last king of Gwynedd and Wales, Llywelyn Ein Llew Olaf's head. Gwynedd is the territory that they ruled over. Basically near enough to the whole of North Wales. At its biggest, would've stretched from Anglesey to Ceredigion. Maelgwn - like Owain Gwynedd - was referred to as 'Maelgwn Gwynedd' because Maelgwn ap Cadwallon was a v common name at the time and it would be fuckin confusing.)

Now, sorting fact from fiction with Maelgwn is... um, difficult, shall we say. Gildas himself said that Maelgwn killed his uncle as previously mentioned, killed his nephew so he could marry his wife, and killed his wife to ensure that she wouldn't object to her husband sharing her bed with another woman. I'm not going into that because I want to keep it short but IT'S WILD.* What we do know suggests that Maelgwn was a deeply religious man, and I'm not being funny, but Gildas smeared like five kings - including Maelgwn's nephew, Cynlas, otherwise known as Cuneglas.

Anyways, while the seat of Aberffraw was traditionally the village of Aberffraw - as the name suggests - Maelgwn's llys (court) was held in Deganwy and where Llywelyn Fawr would later build another llys many years later. 'It is supposed,' Timothy Venning writes, 'that his fort was 'Dinerth on the Clwyd coast, due to which the owner might have been nicknamed 'Artos.' But there is no clear evidence that he was called that but there is plenty of Arthurian sites in Gwynedd! Also, there's a Dinerth in Llandrillo-yn-Rhos near me, and like I like to think maybe there was a fort there somewhere.

He's also known to have given money to many churches and saints which puts Gildas assertions that he was a bad dude in doubt but, I mean, you can make up your mind. In Historia Brittonum, Nennius, remarks, 'the great king Mailcun reigned among the Britons, i.e., in Gwynedd,' and further adds that Cunedda, Maelgwn's ancestor arrived in Gwynedd 146 years ago and slaughtered the Irish living there. He also appears only once in the Welsh Triads in the 'The Tribal Thrones of the Island of Britain' each ruled by King Arthur. Maelgwn was Arthur's Chief of Elders in Mynwy (St. David's, itself a major religious site both for Celts and Christians.)

Honestly, Maelgwn's intertwining with saints is fascinating. It's known, as I've said previously, that he gave to various churches in Gwynedd, while the Book of Llandaff (written in 1125) says he was a benefactor of the Diocese of Llandaff when that first started. Also, his nephew, St. Seriol's, bestie was St Cybi, otherwise known as the lad who gave his name to the Welsh name for Holyhead, 'Caergybi,' which means Cybi's Fort. Maelgwn was, by all accounts, the one who gave the fort to him!

Now, Historium Brittonum is of further interest to us because it, in Kari Maund's words, 'reflects the 9th-century context in which it was written when the rulers of Gwynedd advanced claims of primacy all over Wales.' It would've been, within the rulers of Gwynedd's interests to present Maelgwn and his pedigree as 'pan-Welsh figures,' and many pedigrees further reflect that. (See, when I said sorting fact from fiction was difficult I meant it!)

HB says: 'These are the names of the sons of Cunedda who numbered nine. Tybion was the first-born who died in the land of Manaw of Gododdin and thus did not come with his father and aforesaid brothers. Merrion his son divided the possessions amongst Tybion's brothers: Oswael the second-born, the third Rhufen, the fourth Dunod, the fifth Ceredig, the sixth Afloeg, the seventh Einion Yrth, the eighth Dogfael, the ninth Edern.' The names of these sons became attached to territories within Gwynedd I.e. Dunoding, Rhufeniog, Ceredigion, and, therefore, the divisions (or Cantrefi) of Gwynedd with them. This is propaganda by other monarchs who wanted to show that the Gwyddelian line were the rightful rulers of Ceredigion but it also shows what a Big Fuckin Deal Cunedda and therefore Maelgwn are both as a historical figure and as a propaganda piece. Timothy Venning also suggests that the 'parcelling out' of Gwynedd to members of Cunedda's family was presented by Nennius as 'justification for its reunification by his patron King Merfyn.' Some even say that Owain Gwynedd (him again!) used the legend to 'provide an earlier precedent for its [Gwynedd's] current division' between his sons.' I'm telling u this cuz a) it's of interest because it shows just how embedded this family are in Welsh mythology and culture. Like u cannot go five fuckin mins without seeing them, and b) Maelgwn comes from a fighting pedigree. (And also because I think this is fun.)

Now, Maelgwn's death is pretty confusing. Reports say he died from the 'Yellow Plague or Justinian's Plague' which had made its way over from Byzantium. My school and grandad both said to me when I was little that Maelgwn died from yellow fever passing through a keyhole and infecting him that way which I think is very scary. I would cry if I was confronted with that. Thank you, Ysgol Nant-y-Coed and Grandad Barry, you gave me nightmares about a yellow fog coming to claim me late at night. That's why I now have to block the keyhole of my room door up with blutac. He was buried off Ynys Seriol so yeah. The throne would eventually pass to Maelgwn's son, Rhun, otherwise known as that 'hot lecher of women' himself.

As for Maelgwn, he's bound up in Arthuriana as are his family. Many kings of his line claimed descent from Arthur further down the line and it's not a stretch to think that maybe that's why he's such a big part of Arthuriana. Also, he's such a cool character in his own right that it would be a disservice not to include him. Edern, Maelgwn's great-grandad, is sometimes said to be Guinevere's lover in Welsh mythology, and that would make him and his line have the genes of the wife defender of Britain and the literal Lad Everybody Gets Their Knickers In A Twist Over, Arthur. It's not a stretch to think that later chronicles went fuckin Mad with this info. I would!

*The video about the term 'Wledig' is here.

YouTube

The Royal Title that No One Can Remember

What makes something untranslatable? How about a royal title, or epithet, given to kings and fictional characters for two centuries... befor

* If you want to learn more about these events can I suggest this web page which explains it far better than I ever could:

https://www.ancientwalesstudies.org/id166.html

Tagging people I think might get a kick out of this: @dullyn @gwalch-mei @gawrkin @crwbannwen @believerindaydreams @queer-ragnelle @cesarescabinet

Okay, hwyl fawr! I'll be back next year to chew your ears off about the Mabinogion in the context of ladies or something.

Arthuriana never gets old, and there's always something new to be written and always something which you would not have guessed exists already.

That said, finding an Arthurian poem by Aleister Crowley where Palamedes gives birth to the Questing Beast after killing it, gets pelted with eyeballs, learns music skills equal to Orpheus', rides on an eagle, has a vision of Pan and hears the voice of Christ, becomes a hermit in Finland, and kills his own son out of necessity in the Welsh mountains was not on my bingo card for today.

Arthurian Mirror/Role Reversal AU, where Morgan is the Once and Future Queen, leader of the Dames of the Round Table, who search for the Holy Clau or Holy Rood.

Meanwhile Arthur becomes the Supernatural Raider/Wild Man called "Arthur la Guivre", who terrorizes Morgan's kingdom but ultimately rescues his sister after the final battle, bringing her over to his Otherworldly realm under a Mountain.

Sebile becomes the Sir Kay of this AU.

hi! i apologize if this is outside your ballpark. i recently came across a post about how religion appears in bbc's merlin and it got me thinking about religion in arthurian legend in general. i was wondering if you have any thoughts on the topic? what religions do the characters follow and how does it impact their lives? i know most of the 'cast' is christian but even then medieval christianity is different enough from modern christianity that i constantly feel like i'm missing some nuance/context when i read arthuriana. do other religions feature (such as judaism, islam, pagan spirituality) and are there any essays on it or books where that's explored? thank you for all you do and have a great day!

Hello!

So I’m definitely no religious scholar of any kind. Yet I somehow managed to write an obscenely long post in reply. I've provided copious amounts of literature on everything I'm discussing here, so I encourage anyone who sees this to read what's provided and form their own opinion. Although my reply is based on the Medieval stories I've read and quoted as well as the essays and books of people far more qualified than I am, it's still my own interpretation, and shouldn't be taken as the final word on this highly complex subject. If anyone finds something here I've gotten wrong, please don't hesitate to educate me otherwise and point me in a direction to learn more!

Without further ado...

The first thing anyone looking into this needs to understand is [most of] the Arthurian stories we have were drafted or documented by Christians, oftentimes monks (ie, people very devoted to their religion). Even the texts like the Mabinogion or The Welsh Triads, which contains no Christianity, wasn’t written down until the 12th century after the oral tradition had passed through the Christianizing of Britain. Not to mention translation bias, an oft overlooked factor. For example, French characters Lancelot and Galahad were retroactively added to The Welsh Triads to bring the Triads more in line with the widely popular French narrative. Translator Rachael Bromwich has excellent footnotes regarding this in the file I shared above. So just keep that in mind while reading/researching this subject.

More generally speaking, while some characters themselves aren’t Christian, such as Muslim Palomides or the occasional Jewish character, the texts are [mostly] from an overtly Islamphobic and antisemitic viewpoint. The depictions of religion in Medieval Arthuriana should never be taken as an indication of how things “really were,” either in the time it’s meant to take place (ie, the 5th-6th centuries when the Saxons were colonizing Britain) or the time/place it was written in (ie Chrétien de Troyes wrote from his own 12th century Breton perspective). Point being, it’s all very biased. Perception heavily depends on the place and year things were written and translated. If you're ever unsure which translation of a text will best suit your needs, whether that means accuracy, readability, or containing more robust footnotes, don't hesitate to ask.

That being said, the differences you’re touching on regarding Medieval versus Modern Christianity sometimes stems from Christian Mysticism, which was a prevalent theology in the Middle Ages and still exists today (albeit to a lesser degree). Some contemporary sources on this would be:

The Confessions by Saint Augustine of Hippo

The City of God by Saint Augustine of Hippo

The Book of Divine Works by Saint Hildegard von Bingen

The Letters of Hildegard von Bingen Volume I by Saint Hildegard von Bingen

The Letters of Hildegard von Bingen Volume II by Saint Hildegard von Bingen

The Book of Margery Kempe by Margery Kempe.

Now the thing with Christianity in history and Arthuriana is that the lines between orthodox practice and the mystical was blurred. On an episode about charms, the Medieval Podcast (also available on any podcasting platform like Spotify) explains how people bought and used charms all the time, even within their Christian practice. To them, it was a part of their worship. They may have chanted some words over a sick friend while anointing certain parts of the body in the hopes it would aid in healing. Depending on the time and place, this may or may not have been openly discussed for fear of repercussions or accusations of blasphemy, but it was common enough for historians to have gathered a multitude of examples preserved in spell books. To a desperate Medieval Christian, one of these charms occupied a similar place to Pray the Rosary or Hail Marys in hopes of boosting the success of their endeavor.

So in a similar vein, that concept is sometimes stretched for the sake of an Arthurian story. What you end up with are characters like Merlin, supposedly half-demon, but baptized, therefore his purified magic and prophesizing is considered "Christian;" Morgan le Fay, raised in a nunnery, yet learned necromancy from the holy sisters; and Gawain, who obtained his sun powers, as well as his name, from the hermit that baptized him. At least, so it goes in the Vulgate.

In a way, these people are not magical through their own power, but channeling the divine with the help of their Christian education in order to bestow those benefits, often health, strength, or prosperity related, onto others. (You'll see a lot of real life examples in the contemporary sources I linked above.) Vulgate editor Norris J. Lacy and his translation team left a footnote on the Gawain passage explaining the history of the Gawain/Gwalchmai character that lead me to theorize that this passage might be an attempt by Anonymous to maintain those heightened magical powers while offering a palatable Christian explanation for it.

A similar phenomenon can be seen in Sir Gawain and the Green Knight, the characters are staunchly Christian, and yet the presence of a green-skinned knight astride a green horse who can survive a beheading is seen as marvelous, even miraculous, rather than monstrous. As Larissa Tracy explains in the essay Shifting Skin Passing as Human Passing as Fay, although the Green Knight is Othered by the court, he's not so Othered as to be held entirely apart. He's "tallest of men" and "half a giant." He is still one of the "in" crowd at least a little bit. So while his green coloring shocks the court, and calls to mind Otherworldly fay, in a way similar to the Lady of the Lake or other such beings, the Green Knight isn't viewed as an enemy of the crown so much as a chance for the court to prove its virtue. In the end, this Green Knight was indeed a man, Sir Bertilak, transformed by Morgan le Fay to take on the monstrous visage, and was indeed "one of them" all along. In this way, concepts which seem magical (read: Pagan) to the modern reader remain steeped in Christian ideals. This extends to Gawain's pentacle shield as well, sometimes misconstrued with a similar Pagan symbol, which the poem outright states represents the five virtues of knighthood or even the five wounds of Jesus Christ. Then again, Rhonda Knight's essay All Dressed Up With Someplace to Go: Regional Identity argues the opposite point, that there is indeed a divide. Knight asserts that the poet has intentionally heightened the dichotomy of insider/outsider, particularly as it relates to the Anglo-Welsh border between Sir Bertilak's Wirral and King Arthur's London Camelot. It's quite plain from the moment the Green Knight enters the scene there's a stark split between the two cultures, whether that be interpreted as the people of Wales and the people of England, or the Otherworld associated with Wales and the dominance of Christianity.

But anyway enough about Christians. Let's talk about my friend Sir Palomides and Islam.

A brief recap for anyone who's unfamiliar with Sir Palomides, he's a Muslim knight, referred to in the Medieval Christian tongue as a "Saracen," who vows to convert to Christianity for the sake of marrying Isolde, but curiously hasn't yet. His father, Esclabor, and both of his younger brothers, Segwarides and Safir, have already converted. Palomides is continuously ostracized for his religion/appearance throughout the narrative and considered lesser than Tristan. This is pretty much always the roles they play. Sometimes Palomides is treated with extreme cruelty, such as in the Post-Vulgate, where Galahad forces him to convert to Christianity at sword point, only for Palomides to be murdered shortly afterward by Gawain once his narrative purpose, ie successful conversion, has been fulfilled.

For this break down, I'm ignoring that portrayal of Palomides as well as the Prose Tristan because they suffer from the issues I already outlined regarding Medieval Christian's malicious depiction of non-Christians. And I hate them</3 We'll be turning our attention to Le Morte d'Arthur by Sir Thomas Malory instead as Palomides is slightly more nuanced there. (Very slightly. "The Good Saracen Sir Palomides" is a loaded sentiment, but Malory was a Medieval Englishman imprisoned for his crimes and writing through his madness. We work with what we have.) The copy I linked is translated by Dr. Dorsey Armstrong, not only because it's very good, but because she authored one of the essays I'll be sharing on the subject. She also has a 24 part lecture series on Arthuriana that I highly recommend.

In Le Morte d'Arthur, and the earlier published La Tavola Ritonda as well as Byelorussian Tristan, Palomides is treated a teensy bit better. In most versions of the story, Palomides misses an appointment to duel with Tristan out of cowardice or dishonor. But Malory has written a scenario in which Palomides missed the appointment not out of subservience to Tristan, but because he was jailed elsewhere and couldn't physically make it. He still gets his ass kicked by Tristan, but Malory's change shifts implicational blame of Palomides to circumstantial blame of his situation which serves to create a more sympathetic character. So while Tristan's perception of events remains the same, Palomides is given a narrative excuse which maintains his honor and integrity in the mind of the reader. Yet as Dr. Dorsey Armstrong points out in her essay, Postcolonial Palomides, after Tristan discovers Palomides suffering a bout of grief-induced madness, Palomides's ability to communicate breaks down, and Tristan is unable to understand him. Palomides occupies a space that his fellow "Saracen" knights, such as Priamus of Tuscany, don't. He's Othered by everyone in the narrative yet gains renown among the Christian knights in part because of his extreme desire to join the Round Table, while resisting the necessity to conform to a religious order and community which does not otherwise accept him. Unlike his father and brothers, Palomides seems more aware of, and resistant to, the predatory systems which dictate their conditional acceptance.

Race as a concept did not exist in the Medieval world, rather it was intrinsically tied to religion. That said, colorism was always present. "Saracen" is a term used to refer to Arab people, but according to Hamed Suliman Abuthawabeh, the etymology of the word itself stems from the color brown, ie referential of skin tone. As it relates to fiction... Ever wonder why the Holy Land of the Middle East in Arthurian Legend, where Galahad, Perceval, and Bors seek the grail, is called "Sarras?" Now you know. This concept is not limited to Middle Eastern characters either. Black people in Medieval stories are referred to as "Moorish," ie from the "Moorlands." To that end, ever wonder why Aglovale's half-Black son is named "Morien?" Or how about Parzival's half-Black brother Feirefiz, who's described as having a mixture of "white and black skin," half his father's "fair country Anjou," half his mother's "heathen land Zassamank" with a face two-toned "as a magpie." (Author Wolfram von Eschenbach and translator Jessie Weston's words, not mine).

The fact is non-white, non-Christian characters are often reduced to their skin color, not only in what labels are applied to them as people, but their religions and falsified homelands as well. The cost of a modicum of respect is total assimilation. It's all or nothing for these characters, and even then, it's not a guarantee. Aside from the especially harrowing treatment of Palomides in the Post-Vulgate, this concept appears yet again in the poem The Turk and Sir Gawain, in which Gawain continuously oscillates between foe and friend with an unnamed Turkish knight, only to conclude the story by violently converting this individual through beheading. The Turkish knight is reborn, now Christian, and at last gains a name and identity, Sir Gromer. The expectation put on Pagan knights is so great they must submit to their white comrades and allow them to, literally, kill their former selves to be worthy of personhood in Christendom.

The same can be said of Jewish characters in Arthurian Legend. They're not often the focal point, but they do pop up from time to time. In La Tavola Ritonda, there's Dialantes the Jewish giant, as well as the beautiful Hebrew damsel of Aigua della Spina, who's curiously married to a Christian knight. Then of course there's the rampant antisemitism in Chrétien de Troyes's Perceval, as well as the continuations, which blame "the treacherous Jews" for killing Christ, while also casting Joseph of Arimathea as a Christian knight who brought the Holy Grail to Britain. Furthermore in The History of the Grail portion of the Vulgate, Joe is said to have "converted to the faith of Jesus Christ" while keeping it secret for fear that "the Jews would have killed him." Tons of revisionism happening. The bulk of the Vulgate makes little to no mention of Jewish people, good or bad, as it's mostly tied to the grail story. That said, when it does come up again in The Death of Arthur, it's a slippery slope into every other prejudice, as the term has become synonymous with evil, particularly as it relates to women.

I couldn't possibly outline the entirety of Medieval Christianity's relationship with other religions in a single tumblr post. Here's a link to my huge folder about Race & Religion in the Middle Ages. The essays and books there discuss this subject in a general sense but there's a sub-folder with Arthurian specific essays to learn more about Palomides, Priamus, Gromer, Morien, Feirefiz, and other characters or texts that touch on race/religion.

Despite all of the above, it's not all bad. Sometimes an author was anti-racist toward the non-Christian characters, yet limited by their time. (Think how Herman Melville portrayed Polynesian Queequeg in Moby Dick, positively, but used phrenology to compliment the shape of his skull by comparing him to that of white people. Not up to modern standards, but an attempt at progressive for its time nonetheless.) Looking at Dutch Arthuriana, while Morien's name is an insensitive indication of his unnamed "Moorish" mother, the only characters in the story who treat Morien poorly, such as the boatmen who refuse to ferry him, are openly condemned, even threatened, by the Knights of the Round Table, including Gareth.

I don't know what to call this writing technique, but it's used (and sometimes underutilized...) today. Essentially, as a means to indicate to the reader that the views of the antagonistic (in this case, xenophobic and anti-Black) character isn't shared by the author, they include another character who refutes and combats the negative behavior and who accepts the oppressed party as they are. However rare, it does happen in Medieval texts.

Last but not least, I'd be remiss to omit the Hebrew King Artus from this discussion. It's an incomplete story, but sets out to retell the Arthurian Legend from a Jewish standpoint. All the characters are Jewish and all religious allusions that were once Christian have been rewritten as Jewish. It has a thorough analysis by the translator and tons of footnotes to indicate the Jewish references throughout the text.

Regarding religion in modern Arthuriana like BBC Merlin, Druids aren't actually present in the Legends, with the one and only exception being The Adventure of Melóra and Orlando, which does refer to Merlin as a Druid! There's also the connection made between Merlin and Stonehenge in The History of the King's of Britain by Geoffrey of Monmouth; the word "Druid" is not used, but Merlin describes his own ability to manipulate the stones as "mystical." One has to remember that Druids didn't write down their own history, as it was their way to memorize religious practices and not document anything. All we know about them comes from outside sources, such as Greeks and Romans as well as Christian missionaries come to convert them. As Christianity took hold and figures like Saint Patrick "drove the snakes [Druids] out of Ireland," much of that history was either lost or purposefully maligned. Did the Druids actually participate in human sacrifice? Who knows! Bearing that in mind, we must acknowledge the influence of the several revivals of Druidism and recent boom in Neopaganism; a lot of popular interpretations of Arthurian Legend are just that, the creator's interpretation, and not necessarily indicative of what the historical people would have been doing. To learn more about that, there's Druids: A Very Short Introduction by Barry Cunliffe which I found helpful.

When it comes to Merlin, or Myrddin Wyllt, his character is potentially based on a few different people who really existed, but there isn't a name given to whatever religion they practiced in anything I've read. While the time period did have clearly delineated religions such as Christianity, Judaism, Zoroastrianism (and then Islam), Mithraism, Druidism, etc, there were just as many people who prayed to Jesus Christ while simultaneously leaving out offerings for the local spirits. Most religions come with regional differences, various sects, or shift gradually over time. Saint Patrick himself is said to have had a "fluid identity," as his autobiographical work The Confessions paints him in a fairly positive light as a peaceful missionary, while Dr. Janina Ramirez indicates in her book The Private Life of Saints that other sources characterize Saint Patrick as an aggressor. Some scholars even believe Saint Patrick may have been two different people, combined over the centuries, similarly to Myrddin Wyllt. Modern Arthurian books and shows really lean into a dichotomy between Christianity and the "Old Religion" for the sake of entertainment. But bouts of unrest weren't as fantastical nor made up of two wholly separate, well-defined teams.

Wow this got long. I think we'll leave it at that. I hope that answers your questions! Take care!

you seem like the right person to ask about jewish knights and judaism in general in arthurian legend

Hello! Apologies for how long it has taken me to respond to this! Throughout the Middle Ages and the early modern period, there were a number of Arthurian texts written by and for Jewish people in Jewish languages. The one I specialize in is an Old Yiddish text called Vidvilt, which is part of the Fair Unknown tradition and based off an earlier German text called Wigalois. This text was super popular in the Yiddish-speaking world for about three centuries or so and was reworked and reprinted a number of times. I already discussed some of those adaptations a while ago in response to this ask.

Predating Vidvilt, there was a Hebrew Arthurian text written in the 13th century which is now commonly known as Melekh Artus. This was based on Old French sources and tells the story of Arthur's birth and Lancelot's affair with Guinevere before breaking off unfinished. The most common edition of the text used today is the one by Curt Leviant, though I just read a fascinating article in the latest issue of the Journal of the International Arthurian Society calling into question some of his transcription choices and the conclusions he draws in his analysis of the text.

I also recently read that a fragment of an Arthurian text in Judeo-Catalan was recently discovered, but I'm afraid I don't know much about it as yet other than that it's apparently a late medieval adaptation of Jaufre.

Chivalric romances of both Christian and Jewish origin were extremely popular among medieval and early modern Jews in general. There were a number of non-Arthurian knight stories that were very popular as well; for example, the most famous and influential work of early Yiddish literature was a chivalric epic called Bovo d'Antona, and a survey I read of the literature in Jewish households in early modern Italy shows that the most popular non-religious work among Jews at that time was Orlando Furioso.

It is worth noting that, even though some of these texts were written by and for Jews, that doesn't necessarily mean that the characters in them were Jewish. Jewish writers generally tended to modify their Christian source materials by gliding over or obscuring references to religion, rather than depicting Judaism directly (the reasons for this are complex and could constitute a whole paper, so I won't get into it here). That being said, medieval Jewish knights did exist in real life, too! There are a few medieval historians who do research into exactly when, where, and under what circumstances Jews were allowed to bear arms, but it definitely wasn't exclusively a literary thing.

To add a little clarity, Jenny Rowland in that book isn't actually saying the poem is bad; she finds it very interesting and is mostly analysing it from a detached perspective for the antiquarian traditions it records. There's some commentary on the poetic skill, both positive and negative, which is where the section I posted is from; it's mentioning there's slightly less metrical, technical skill vis a vis the rules and forms of medieval Welsh poetry than some other saga *englynion*, supporting her proposition this dialogue dates from after the form's heyday. I just screencapped a bit I thought was funny out of context because I have a mutual who likes Gwyn a lot and thought they might enjoy seeing him getting kinda bullied, ahah

Fair enough, I can agree with that, and I probably should have read into it further before reblogging. I suppose from my own reading I've become accustomed to vicious authorly attacks on Welsh anti-blorbos. Like this:

Wow, Laurence Main, tell us how you really feel with those sarcastic parentheses on "St" Illtyd! (For the record, I have met that author, and he is a delight to know, but he does not hold back about "Old Ill-Tide" or Gildas and also hates Taliesin with a burning passion).

Or this, from Adam Ardrey:

More sarcastic quotation marks and more hate for Gildas, who was not gentle in his own works and didn't mention King Arthur in any of his surviving writing and is still getting flamed for it around a millenium and a half later by people who are Maelgwyn fans, are trying to prove Arthur was real,* or both. I have written mediocre Gildas fanfiction at two in the morning with this as the fuel, because I think he probably gets too much hate, though having never met him, I can't judge any better than the people who claim he burned his praise of Arthur for petty reasons.

Anyway, this post went off the rails a lot, but all that is to say that literary scholarship can get incredibly opinionated, it's easy to fall into one viewpoint or become overly cynical about it in general, and I think I have mostly done the latter. Also, that Jenny Rowland book sounds rather interesting; I might have to check it out.

*For the record, I have no firm stance on the matter, since as far as I can tell it can't be proven or disproven. In my head, he both was and was not real. Schrödinger's King. Or warrior, rather.

This is slander. "Ymddiddan Gwyddno Garanhir a Gwyn ap Nudd" is interesting (and a little confusing, as a lot of the best poems are). Here is the best breakdown of it which I've found online.

Reading Jenny Rowland's Early Welsh Saga Poetry (largely due to my interest in the stories around Urien Rheged) and had a moment of "oh! @wildbasil come pick up your boy"

...followed very quickly by the author, uh, roasting Gwyn for his pedestrian poetry???

Give the man a break lmao

Arthurian Quotes I Love, pt. ?

“The music of the sword of the High-king of the World”. I love that phrase. Given that this is TSotCED, it could be poetic imagery or an actual, magical singing sword, but either way, I think it’s beautiful, and so is Lancelot recognizing Bhalbhuaidh by the sound of a weapon which Arthur lent him for his quest. Here, Galahad/Bhalbhuaidh, who might actually be intended to be Gawain, is not said to be Lancelot’s son and was fostered by Arthur (who is the High-king of the World, not only Britain or Logres). That Arthur raised him and gave him the sword, that Arthur sent Lancelot to lead the search party for his ward, and that Lancelot was immediately able to recognize him by the sound alone says a lot about how close to Arthur both of them are and how they slot into the court in general. You get so much from that one phrase.

The bit at the end about the Knight of the Lantern being able to fly like a bird is only a plus.

could you tell me about arthur's bastard (and legitimate) children?

(Word of Caution: For various reasons, including inaccessibility of source materials, I am not fully read up on all the details of the source materials involving the following characters. Nor am I aware of all known children of Arthur. Therefore, I should advice discretion)

First are the two major sons, both of whom changed legitimacies as the legend evolved:

Mordred - Originally a nephew by Arthur's full sister Anna/Morgause in Historia Regum Britanniae, Mordred is later converted into Arthur's bastard son, conceived incestuously, in Vulgate Cycle. The Welsh Dream of Rhonabwy suggests that Mordred was fostered by Arthur (a normal practice of both Romans and Celts)

Loholt/Ilinot - First appeared in Erec and Enide and apparently based on the Welsh character of Llacheu, Loholt was originally a Legitimate son of Arthur by Guinevere in Perlesvaus and the German Tradition. But Vulgate Cycle alters this so that Loholt is instead another bastard son by a certain Lisanor prior to Arthur's marriage to Guinevere.

Next are the ones with Unknown Mothers (and thus of ambiguous legitimacy and relationship to Guinevere):

Amr/Amhar - Son of Arthur mentioned in Historum Brittonum as being killed by Arthur himself. His grave is described as naturally changing size with every look, implying supernatural influence. He is also mentioned in the Welsh Geraint, as one of Arthur's Four Chamberlains

Gwydre - Son of Arthur mentioned only in Culhwch and Olwen. He is killed by Twrch Trwyth alongside two maternal uncles of Arthur.

Llacheu - The most celebrated of the Welsh sons of Arthur, with mentions in Pa Gur, The Welsh Triads and other Welsh Poetic Material. Is usually identified with Loholt, with the Welsh adaptation of Perlesvaus - Y Seint Grail - being the most notable in that regard.

Duran - Son of Arthur only found in a 15th Century Welsh Manuscript, where he is said to have perished during the Battle of Camlann

Archfedd - Daughter of Arthur, found in the Welsh genealogical work Bonedd Y Saint, where she is said to have married Llawfrodedd, one of Arthur's warriors, and bore two children, Efadier and Gwrial

Apollonius, Iron and Hilde - Two sons and a daughter found in the 13th Century Icelandic Thidrekssaga.

Aristes - Son of Arthur mentioned in the Old Norse Mottuls saga

Legitimate Children of Arthur (Although not necessarily Guinevere's children)

Samson the Fair and Grega - Son and Daughter of Arthur by his wife, Queen Silvia. Both found in the Norse Samson saga fraga

Adeluf III, Morgan the Black and Patrick the Red - Three sons of Arthur, from Eldest to Youngest, from Rauf de Boun's 14th century chronicle, Petit Brut. Presumbly, sons of Queen Guinevere, but Rauf de Boun fails to mention the name of Arthur's wife. However, Adeluf III is made heir and assumes the Throne of England whilst Patrick and Morgan are given sizable inheritances in the form of Scotland and Wales. (Note: Wikipedia claims they're Arthur's sons by a fairy queen, but the cited source does not say so. Link to source HERE)

Seleucia - Daughter of Arthur by his first wife, Liscanor (Lisanor), in Jorge Ferreira de Vasconcelos' 16th century Portugese novel Memorial das Proezas da Segunda Tavola Redonda. (*This technically makes her the full sister of Lisanor!Loholt) She married Arthur's successor, Sagramor Constantino (a combination of Sir Sagramore and Constantine, son of Cador) and may have even bore a daughter, Princess Licorida

Huncamunca - Daughter of Arthur and his wife, Queen Dollalolla, from Henry Fielding's 1730 Tom Thumb play

Melora - Daughter of Arthur and Guinevere from the Irish romance Eachtra Mhelóra agus Orlando. One of the more well-known daughters of Arthur and one of the very few warrior women in Arthuriana.

Merevie/Smerbe/Smerviemore - Son of Arthur by his second marriage to a french princess, Elizabeth. Figures primarily in the genealogical legends of Scottish Clan Campbell, who claim descent from Arthur through Smervie.

Rowland, Ellen and Two unnamed older brothers - Certain versions of the Ballad of Childe Rowland and Burd Ellen portray them as the sons and daughter of Arthur and Guinevere, apparently due to the mention of Merlin.

Tryphine's son and daughter - A certain mystery play collected by François-Marie Luzel in 1863 merges Saint Tryphine from the Conomor legend with aspects of Queen Guinevere, with the primary antagonist being the lady's brother Kervoura. The two children are unnamed, but the son goes by an alias, "the Malouin"

Iduna - Daughter of Arthur and Guinevere from Edgar (1839), by Adolph Schutt

Blandine - Daughter of Arthur and Guinevere from Les Chevaliers de la Table Ronde (1937), by Jean Cocteau

Bastard Children of Arthur:

Kyduan/Cydfan - Son of Arthur by Eleich ferch Iaen. Mentioned in Culhwch and Olwen and Bonedd yr Arwyr

Arthur le Petit - Son of Arthur from Post-Vulgate, born of Arthur's deliberate rape of a daughter of Sir Tanas. Arthur le Petit serves as a "good" counterpart to Sir Mordred. He loyally serves his father incognito for many years and despises Lancelot's faction for causing the destruction of Logres. He is slain by Sir Bleoberis.

Tom a Lincoln - Eponymous hero of the 16th century romance Tom a Lincoln, by Richard Johnson. Son of Arthur by Angelica, a daughter of the Mayor of London. Fathers two additional characters, the Black Knight and the Faerie Knight.

Gyneth - Daughter of Arthur by a half-genie named Guendolen. From Walter Scott's The Bridal of Triermain (1813). A huntress whose Marriage competition results in the death of many knights including Vanoc, who is implied to be Merlin's son. As a result, Merlin puts her into an enchanted sleep for many centuries until her true love awakens her with a kiss.

And finally, those with a tenuous link to Arthuriana:

Nathalia - a supposed daughter of Arthur who accompanied St. Ursula according to De Sancta Ursula: De undecim milibus Virginum martirum (1183), by Herman Joseph

Baeddo - Wife of the Visigothic Spanish king Reccared. Claimed to be a daughter of Arthur by Compendio Historial, by Esteban de Garibay y Zamalloa

Tortolina - a daughter of Arthur according to Pantochronachanon (1652), by Thomas Urquhart

*(Additional Source link about the Daughters of King Arthur: HERE)

New headcanon that Gareth's hair color changed dramatically as he grew up and by the time he sees his older brothers again he resembles a different relative than whoever he used to look most like, so they don't recognize him but he seems eerily familiar to them

Gawain: You know, you remind me of my younger brother... Gareth [mentally]: He recognizes me! Gawain:...Gaheris. Gareth [mentally]: Facepalms

Hi-Lo Arthuriana

Have a high interest in Arthurian Legend but low readability?

Here's a collection of adapted or abridged books to help ease you into the literary tradition. This list is ordered from simplest to most complex, beginning with picture books and ending with "translations" of Middle English texts into modern English or abridged versions of longer texts such as the Vulgate. Books in a series are numbered.

As always, if the book is still in print, I link to the Internet Archive to read, Goodreads to learn more, or where you can purchase. Supporting living authors is very important! Otherwise, enjoy a PDF, on me, to keep the legacy of these authors alive.

Picture Books

Young Merlin (Young Series #1) by Robert D San Souci & Jamichael Henterly (1989)

Tales From the Mabinogion Gwyn Thomas, Kevin Crossley-Holland, & Margaret Jones (1992)

Sir Gawain and The Loathly Lady by Selina Hastings & Juan Wijngaard (1985)

The Quest for Olwen by Gwyn Thomas, Kevin Crossley-Holland, & Margaret Jones (1988)

The Kitchen Knight by Margaret Hodges & Trina Schart Hyman (1990)

Sir Gawain and The Green Knight by Selina Hastings & Juan Wijngaard (1991)

The Tale of Taliesin by Gwyn Thomas, Kevin Crossley-Holland, & Margaret Jones (1992)

Young Guinevere (Young Series #2) by Robert D San Souci & Jamichael Henterly (1992)

The Knight with The Lion by John Howe (1996)

Young Lancelot (Young Series #3) by Robert D San Souci & Jamichael Henterly (1996)

Young Arthur (Young Series #4) by Robert D San Souci & Jamichael Henterly (1997)

Sir Gawain and The Green Knight by Michael Morpurgo & Michael Foreman (2004)

Perceval: King Arthur's Knight of The Holy Grail by John Perkins & Gennady Spirin (2007)

Comics

Prince Valiant by Hal Foster & many others (1937-present)

Camelot 3000 by Brian Bolland and Mike W. Barr (1982-1985)

Arthur, King of Time and Space by Paul Gadzikowski (2004-2014)

Tristan & Isolde: The Warrior and The Princess by Jeff Limke (2008)

Muppets King Arthur by Paul Benjamin & Patrick Storick (2010)

Gradalis WEBTOON [carrd] by @kochei0 (2021-present)

Chivalry by Neil Gaiman & Colleen Doran (2022)

Children's Chapter Books

The Adventures of Sir Lancelot the Great (The Knights' Tales #1) by Gerald Morris (2009)

The Adventures of Sir Givret the Short (The Knights' Tales #2) by Gerald Morris (2009)

The Adventures of Sir Gawain the True (The Knights' Tales #3) by Gerald Morris (2013)

The Adventures of Sir Balin the Ill-Fated (The Knights' Tales #4) by Gerald Morris (2013)

The Legends of King Arthur: Merlin, Magic, and Dragons (#1-#10) by Tracey Mayhew (2020)

Intermediate Retellings

The Idylls of The King by Alfred Lord Tennyson (1859)

The Story of King Arthur and His Knights (#1) by Howard Pyle (1903)

The Story of the Champions of The Round Table (#2) by Howard Pyle (1905)

The Story of Sir Launcelot and His Companions (#3) by Howard Pyle (1907)

The Story of The Grail and The Passing of Arthur (#4) by Howard Pyle (1910)

Hero Myths & Legends of the British Race by M. I. Ebbutts (1910)

The Squire’s Tale (The Squire’s Tales #1) by Gerald Morris (1998)

The Squire, His Knight, and His Lady (The Squire’s Tales #2) by Gerald Morris (1999)

The Savage Damsel and The Dwarf (The Squire’s Tales #3) by Gerald Morris (2000)

Parsifal’s Page (The Squire’s Tales #4) by Gerald Morris (2001)

The Ballad of Sir Dinadan (The Squire’s Tales #5) by Gerald Morris (2003)

The Princess, The Crone, and The Dung-Cart Knight (The Squire’s Tales #6) by Gerald Morris (2004)

The Lioness and Her Knight (The Squire’s Tales #7) by Gerald Morris (2005)

The Quest of The Fair Unknown (The Squire’s Tales #8) by Gerald Morris (2006)

The Squire’s Quest (The Squire’s Tales #9) by Gerald Morris (2009)

The Legend of The King (The Squire’s Tales #10) by Gerald Morris (2010)

Abridged Medieval Literature Translations

Sir Gawain and The Green Knight (Unrepresented #1) by Jessie Weston (1889)

Tristan & Iseult (Unrepresented #2) by Jessie Weston (1899)

Guingamor, Lanval, Tyolet, Bisclaveret (Unrepresented #3) by Jessie Weston (1900)

Morien (Unrepresented #4) by Jessie Weston (1901)

Sir Cleges, Sir Libeaus Desconus (Unrepresented #5) by Jessie Weston (1902)

Sir Gawain At The Grail Castle (Unrepresented #6) by Jessie Weston (1903)

Sir Gawain & The Lady of Lys (Unrepresented #7) by Jessie Weston (1907)

The Story of Sir Galahad by Mary Blackwell Sterling & William Ernest Chapman (1908)

The Romance of King Arthur and His Knights of The Round Table by Alfred W Pollard & Arthur Rackham (1917)

Le Morte d'Arthur by Keith Baines (1962)

The Lancelot-Grail Reader by Norris J. Lacy (2000)

Lancelot and The Lord of The Distant Isles by Patricia Terry, Samuel N. Rosenberg, & Judith Jaidinger (2007)

The Wedding of Sir Gawain and Dame Ragnell by David Breeden (????)

Informational Resources

Warriors of Arthur by John Matthews, Bob Stewart, & Richard Hook (1987)

The New Arthurian Encyclopedia by Norris J. Lacy (1991)

The Arthurian Companion by Phyllis Ann Karr (1997)

The Arthurian Name Dictionary by Christopher W. Bruce (1999)

okay sorry thinking about false guinevere again and I think I get it now. like if you were raised alongside your beautiful sister, the beautiful daughter of the king, and she gets everything and everyone loves her and she marries the guy who pulls the sword out of the stone and she’s the queen now and everyone’s looking to her and knights are dying for her and you look exactly like her and you have her same face, your father’s face, but the man who raised you isn’t him because no one can talk about what the king did to your mom and everyone pretends it’s normal but actually they all know you were born from violence and you were never supposed to be born and there she is, your sister, with your same name, your same face, the most desired woman alive, and she is everything you’re not. i might also do something evil tbh

if the sight of a jew doing culturally jewish things and/or practicing the religion makes a person go 🫵 POTENTIAL EVIL LYING CHILD KILLING ZIONIST, APPROACH WITH CAUTION🫵 they are already antisemitic. and it’s going to take a lot of research and self-reckoning and uhh talking to jews in good faith for them to come back from that mindset. and many won’t undergo that process because it’s uncomfortable and shame-producing. and i honestly can’t show grace to folks who have unknowingly fallen down that rabbit hole because the conflation of “jewish” with “evil and bad” has already gotten jews killed this year. and it’s gotten jews killed for thousands of years. and unless gentiles start unpacking that long-ingrained cultural assumption that Jew = Suspicious, Probably Evil, Destroy Now we’ll see more pogroms in the future.

and before you come into my mentions with “but israel,” please understand that gentiles have never needed proof to believe jews are evil and murder them. right now, antisemites are gleeful that they have a “reason” and too many of y’all are just following their lead because you refuse to engage with this information. because you’re not an antisemite, right? you just hate zionists, not jews. and you definitely know what zionism is and you definitely can surmise when zionist is being used as a dogwhistle. right! of course! there is no historical precedent that would lead me to not believe a single word you say.

so like. if you truly want to help fight antisemitism, you have to engage with these ideas even if the process is uncomfortable and shame-producing. you have to unlearn 2,000 years of lies about us and the deeply ingrained instinct to believe we are evil. idk why i’m making this post i just wish gentiles would be believe us when we say It’s Really That Fucking Dire.

The funny thing is that in Knight of the Parrot, Arthur leaves KING LOT HIMSELF in charge and somehow everything turns out swell.

i’ll leave my nephew in control of the kingdom while i go to fight in rome it’ll be fine 

Maybe Apollo. They have a few similarities. Aphrodite might, too, and she and Apollo are both on the Trojan side.

It looks like Gawain is standing by Hector. Then again, if Hector is de Maris, that would make Lancelot Paris, Guinevere Helen, and Arthur Menelaus, so it makes more sense for Gawain to be an Achaean on Arthur/Menelaus' side.

In that case, Gawain probably has the best Achilles parallel: fighting out of a furious desire for revenge, sometimes at odds with his commander (though Arthur is the opposite of Agamemnon, at least in Morte, since he doesn't want to be fighting the war), and killed due to an injury in a specifically vulnerable place (Gawain's re-wounded head, Achilles' heel). That being said, I think the gods on the Trojan side are a better fit for Gawain than the gods on the Greek side.

If Sir Gawain could time travel and dropped into the Trojan War, which Greek God(s) would start supporting him?

That is very relatable because I did the exact same thing. Here's a partial list of my own awful ideas:

It started with Marianne Le Fay (I didn't like the name Morgan, so I renamed her) being so called because she was friends with fairies in the French Alps, then shifted to her being a changeling child who was raised by fey beings after Uther and the rest of his hunting party was killed while hunting a wild boar in Broceliande. No adequate explanation was given for why a three-year-old princess was taken along to hunt a wild boar.

Camelot was actually named Caramel-Not. Bors told people in the foreign countries he was in while he had amnesia that he was from a camel-lot and it stuck. (Also, Bors converted to Hinduism, regained his memory, and decided never to go back. All this was mentioned offhand--he hadn't lived in Camelot for years and never showed up in the story).

Prior to the start, Mordred somehow drove every human apart from him and Arthur, who he kept mostly unconscious, out of Camelot through wild goose chase quests, falsely tarnished names, and more creative but always nonlethal methods.

Mordred isekai'd Guinevere to a world made of clouds. The first part of the plot was just her trying to get back.

Mordred stuck Agravaine, Gareth, and Gaheris on a boat and set it adrift so that listening to Agravaine singing "The Ballad of the Pickled Cabbage" would eat away at the others' sanity.

Gawain and "Gallahad" were best friends. Gallahad was kind of a rustic himbo, in contrast to Percival, who was older and had found the Grail before he showed up (I actually like the last bit's angst potential).

Lancelot was really evil and in league with Anna (who was evil). Guinevere, Gawain, and Gallahad all hated him.

Mordred was a sorcerer and had a strix named Deluge who wanted to be named Norman as his familiar. (I know it makes no sense but I still have a soft spot for corny socially awkward evil wizard Mordred).

Arthur and Guinevere were going to get their marriage annulled, then eventually remarry, because the marriage was arranged and also because when they first married, Guinevere was under a curse.

The whole thing began with a seventh-grade assignment to write an alliterative paragraph, so a weird number of words in the prologue started with the letter G. Thus, we have Gawain grappling a ghastly green ghoul over a golden grail (not THE Grail, apparently, but that isn't clear until much later) at the very start.

Pendragons could turn into literal dragons. Mordred, as Uther's grandson, could turn into one despite lacking the Pendragon name, since it was genetic, but Guinevere could also turn into one because she was a Pendragon by marriage. (The lore was a bit spotty). The climax of the book was going to be an epic dragon battle between Mordred and Guinevere.

There's a bit more of that sort of thing, but I'll leave it there for now.

so a few years ago, before I realised that there was such a thing as an Arthuriana fandom on Tumblr that I could mine for resources, I decided, in my infinite wisdom, to start writing a novel.

now where this goes off the rails is the fact that I a) did no research and b) had some pretty unusual ideas about the characters I was going to be using. having since found out some actual, concrete information on these characters, I thought it would be fun to go through my old ideas and see how fucking wild they are in comparison to what I now know the characters are actually like.

Kea's list of awful ideas:

morgan le fay was going to be a werewolf

king arthur was going to be colourblind and have a peanut allergy as his only identifying traits

lancelot was going to murder his abusive merchant father by staging a cart crash in the middle of the woods, then stabbing him in the confusion. for plot reasons

Nimue/lady of the lake and Lancelot were going to be adoptive siblings who were raised by the wild hunt (still kinda fuck with the siblings idea tbh)

Kay was going to be Arthur's dog.

Guinevere x Lancelot? nah, Guinevere x Lancelot's sister (also still kinda fuck with this, give that woman some lesbianism she deserves it)

the main villain was going to be some random ass faerie assassin called the Shrike, so called because it skewered knights on trees (I used to listen to far too much hozier, if you couldn't guess)

Arthur, Lancelot and Merlin were going to be in a polyam relationship and Guinevere, Nimue and Morgan were going to be in a polyam relationship, which, if you consider the two pairs of siblings in that collection, means that the family tree of these characters is literally a circle.

the Fae were going to have big fuckass bird wings for no particular reason other than I thought it would be cool

I have so many more of these, if this breaches containment I'll make another

Tag game: tag nine people you’d like to know better.

Tagged by: @oneshoulderangel (Thank you for tagging me!)

Last song: At the moment, I have "Losing Your Memory" by Alan Star stuck in my head, which I suppose makes it my current song, not my last song. Hm. I get songs stuck in my head very easily, but the last one I had there for a significant amount of time was a mashup of different language versions of "Les Rois du Monde" for about a week. "Lehetsz Király", the Magyar version, is probably my favorite of them. It's worth a listen.

Currently watching: Normally, the answer would be "random mostly terrible old movies/shows" or "nothing much", but I currently have a hyperfixation on the musical Roméo et Juliette and have been watching it in multiple languages. (Thus, the song).

Three ships: This is hard. Maybe as a result of being on the ace and aro spectrums, I'm more likely to care about which characters are interacting than whether it's romantic or platonic. Here goes:

Kedivere/Bedikay. It can be romantic, platonic, or queerplatonic, but whichever way, I'm here for it. I probably spend too much time thinking about how in Cullwch and Olwen, when Cai gets mad at Arthur and marches out, Bedwyr stays behind, keeps acting like nothing's happened, and isn't the one to avenge Cai's death. The feeling of betrayal on both sides has a lot of unexplored potential. And the version where Bedivere dies and Kay fights to bring his body back safely while mortally wounded himself... And the version where Bedivere survives Camlann and Kay isn't said to fight in it, so they might be left together after their world has fallen apart...

Platonically or queerplatonically, Galahad and the Grail Heroine. I really like the tragic Grail Quest friendships, but I like theirs most, maybe because there's something weird and otherworldly about them both. I like it when characters are strange and endearing and doomed by the narrative.

Ever since reading John Matthews' retelling, which I read before the original, I've had a soft spot for Caradoc and Guinier. The Story of Caradoc is very disturbing, and I have some major qualms with Caradoc over a detail Matthews cut out, but all the same, there's a reason these two have the best track record with magical fidelity tests. Each of them would go to the ends of the earth for the other, and together, they're stronger than any curse.

Favorite Color: Blue, particularly royal blue and some teals.

Currently consuming: Black licorice with chocolate.

First ship: This is a hard one, since through elementary and most of middle school, I tended to go along with whatever I thought the author's intentions were and was more likely to unship something. The first non-endgame ship I got invested in was Sonya/Nikolai in War and Peace. I didn't like Nikolai, but Sonya did, and she was my favorite character, so I wanted her to be happy. The first non-canon couple I thought was meant to be together was also in War and Peace: Marya Bolkonskaya and Julie Karagina. My eighth grade self did not think their letters could be interpreted platonically. I still don't.

Last movie: If the musical doesn't count, the last movie I watched was Quest for Camelot, which was awful. Though not Robot Monster-level bad, Robot Monster has an elegance to its simplicity which Quest for Camelot lacks.

Currently working on: Various fics, most of them Arthuriana or CotRK-related (I am woefully behind on the Badfic Bingo), and (theoretically) an epic-style poem, though I haven't gotten much of it written for quite a while now.

Tagging: @gawrkin, @emperorcandy, @wildbasil, @gorewound, @knightsofsomethingorother, @ladyminaofcamelot, @tasosotaso, @amashelle, @gingersnaptaff (I have no idea who's been tagged so far, apart from the people on @oneshoulderangel's post, so I apologize for any multi-tags)

It was a musical, but...I am not beating the allegations.

I shall take this as an opportunity to ramble about Rómeó és Júlia, the subject of said allegations by @unstark, who may have created a monster (/j; thank you for doing so).

The first thing to know is that I haven't read Romeo and Juliet since middle school and liked it well enough then but wasn't really enthused because I liked the poetic elements but found the romance somewhat grating. However, I am a theater kid/opera nerd at heart, and looking at different versions of things and analyzing the connections, sometimes to an obsessive degree, is one of the things I live for (that's part of the lure of Arthuriana).

The second is that Rómeó és Júlia (ResJ) is fantastic, in large part because the cast is incredibly talented. I've seen all or a good portion of several different language versions of the musical, which originated in France as Roméo et Juliette (RetJ), and they all have good or decent but reasonably similar Juliets and mostly fine to mediocre Romeos. In addition to having a good Juliet, this Romeo, played by Dolhai Attila, was quite charming as an actor as well as a great singer so the rest have been mostly downhill. I am afraid, though, that like most of the people on ResJ/RetJ Tumblr, the characters I found most interesting were Mercutio and Tybalt, who both vary wildly from production to production. In ResJ, Mercutio (who fans call Zolicutio because he's played by Zoltán Bereczki) is a force of nature, and I did not properly appreciate that the first time I watched it. He sings, dances almost constantly, acts well, and raps in Magyar, and he never seems to stop or slack in energy until he dies. Tybalt, on the other hand, is a deeply tortured soul who's occasionally comedic in his melodrama (he does the Mr. Bean walk once) but has genuine pathos. I originally watched the first half without subtitles and did not realize the...ahem...concerning nature of his thoughts about Juliet, but that's in almost every version of the musical, and it is not as big a trigger warning as the obvious one, which is that Romeo and Juliet includes onstage suicide and murder, as well as references to sexual content. This is probably the first thing anyone learns about Romeo and Juliet, but I thought I should put that out there to be safe. Anyway, Szilveszter Szabó was vastly different than how I pictured Tybalt while reading the play, but he was excellent and brought a new perspective to the character. You love to see it. Also, ResJ Benvolio is a punk with the heart of a golden retriever, another far-from-the-play take which works in its context.

Now, the 2010 French version. I followed ResJ with the RetJ revival because John Eyzen's Mercutio is the second most popular Mercutio on Tumblr, after the inimitable Zolicutio, and I wanted to see what the hype was about. He is vastly, vastly different, both from how I imagined Mercutio and how Mercutio is in any other production. Eycutio alternates between stillness and over-the-top energy. He may or may not be bad mental illness rep. He may or may not be beholden to the madness-inducing entities of Chaos. Eyzen fully embraced the vibes of "La Follie" and the Queen Mab speech Mercutio has in Shakespeare to create a very unstable dude who revels in unpredictability and danger to a greater degree than Zolicutio and has probably won Best-Haired Veronese Man three years in a row. He has a love/hate relationship with Tybalt and flirts with him while fighting. (Zolicutio also flirts with Tybalt, but less in a I've-secretly-liked-you-since-we-were-twelve-but-also-hate-you-and-we-kissed-at-a-party-once-but-you-pretend-you-don't-remember-and-I'm-going-to-make-that-hard-for-you way than an I-bet-you're-into-me-and-also-that-you'll-hate-this-and-I-could-be-into-you-but-it's-not-clear-and-I-canonically-kissed-Romeo-but-didn't-seem-serious-about-it-and-I-rap-about-not-liking-romance-and-it-might-be-to-hide/drown/prevent-the-pain-or-I-might-be-aroallo-and-thriving way). Tim Ross's 2nd Tybalt looks and acts like the unlikely and maltreated test-tube child of George Michael and Cruella de Vil, and I'm going to leave it about that, because I have rambled too long without mentioning that Romeo's costume is exceptionally terrible in this one, that I really did not like Escalus, and that the Nurse was fantastic. All in all, what this one has to recommend it is the excellent Nurse, plus Tybalt and Mercutio's unevenly acted but ultimately interesting dynamic, which is the stuff of Fanlore pages.

I have not watched all of the 2001 French original, even though many people say Cécilia Cara is the best Juliet, because the other Juliets are also good and apparently a bald Mercutio is one thing I cannot take. (I could under certain conditions. If he were a young cancer patient, then that would add an urgency to his fervor for living life to the fullest, and a suspicion that he's going to die painfully soon whatever he does could influence his recklessness, but him being considerably older and more sophisticated than Romeo is weird). I might watch more of it, but it's low priority.

Apart from those, I've watched large parts of the Italian and Israeli ones, which I prefer to the French ones in acting but not in singing. The Italian one is a lot more dramatic than the Israeli one, which is maybe the least dramatic RetJ variant ever but pulls it off really well. The characters seem like normal people you would meet who try their best but get caught up in a tragedy bigger than they can understand. Of special note, as usual, is that ever-shifting scene, the duel between Mercutio and Tybalt, and this is the most original take on it I've seen. What sets it apart is that THEY DON'T EVEN DISLIKE EACH OTHER. You get the sense that they've had a lighthearted rivalry since they were kids but they're sort of friends and it's all a game to them. It's also the only version I've seen where those two actually have fencing swords, so the fight looks more realistic, emphasizing that they're playing with fire. When he realizes Mercutio is dying, Tybalt is visibly devastated and seems to lose the will to live. I don't usually cry at movies or shows, but that is the version which brought me the closest to crying.

I would like to watch the 2019 Toho version, since it comes highly recommended, but am not sure where to and might have to wait a while on that one. After I'm done with the Italian one, I intend to watch the Russian one, the German one, and the alternate cast recording of the Hungarian one. As for the English one...well, I've listened to a bit of it, and it was awful.

If you want to watch multiple versions at once or see which ones you might like, there is a great playlist on YouTube where someone edited together parts of the videos of different versions. If you want an incoherent-without-watching-the-full-thing but possibly still entertaining look into it, watch this compilation someone made, which is extremely funny if you've actually seen the full musical.

If you've read this entire semi-coherent ramble, you're a trooper. I hope it was vaguely interesting. Have a wonderful day!

it’s really easy to become obsessed with a shakespeare play you just have to watch one version of it and then read the play and then go mad trying to watch every possible version of it you can find and then study several centuries worth of performance history and controversy

If we go down,

then

we go down

together

Song lyric from "Paris" by the Chainsmokers; paintings by Herbert Draper, John Duncan, John William Waterhouse, N.C. Wyeth, Sidney Meteyard, Edmund Leighton, Rogelio de Egusquiza, N.C. Wyeth, August Spieß, Harry R. Mileham, August Spieß

lament for sir kay by me. thinking about him always. i can't imagine having my younger brother become king and. like. just. what the fuck. i love him. no one understands him like i do.

Happy Halloween to Guinevere's mother's terrifying prophetic ghost

The Adventures of Arthur at the Tarn Wadling (Jessie Weston translation)

I love speculating about medieval Welsh poetry! As a Cauldron Kids enthusiast, I'd like to elaborate a little about the poetic bit with Creirwy and Garwy Hir. Here it is in Welsh and English:

Whether Hywel ab Einion Llygliw (yes, a different Hywel) is drawing a parallel between his feelings for Myfanwy Fychan and Garwy's feelings for Creirwy or whether he's referencing two unconnected characters, one known for being beautiful and the other known for an unhappy love life or just a lot of generalized woes, is kind of ambiguous, so while I would be happy to have more Creirwy lore, unless there's some other source which mentions this, I don't think we can say that it's supposed to mean they were in a relationship for certain. There's also another Creirwy, daughter of Saint Gwen the Triple-Breasted, though I don't think she's as likely to be the one referenced here.

I'd also like to add that one really dubious Wikipedia entry claims Myfanwy married Goronwy ap Tudur Hen. This is a fun tidbit because he's yet another guy named Goronwy, though almost certainly not the "Cad Goddeu" poet's pal Goronwy, and because if it were true, that would make her a direct ancestor of the House of Tudor.

Hello, it's me. I am back again to bore you all to utter DEATH.

Okay, so I was doing some reading in my lil book nook and I came across this poem:

(Sorry it's sideways. I hate it too.)

It's Ode Five by Hywel ab Owain Gwynedd (who is awesome in his own right. Might do a post about him if anybody would like it.) Anyways, there are two (2) things that jumped out straight off that I have highlighted:

1. The reference to Ogrfan Fawr who is Gwenhwyfar's dad. It's super interesting to me that it reads a bit like Hywel (or whoever is narrating the poem) uses Ogrfan to imply that he's being kept apart from his lover. (Presumably the fair - pls remember Gwen is another word for fair, or white, in Welsh - shy girl lady he mentions in the second line.)

Who's got fair in their name? Gwenhwyfar. "Okay, Sarah," I imagine you're saying. "Cool stuff. But what the fuck does this have to do with a twelfth-century poet dude and a fictional queen?"

Ah, okay. WELL. LEMME REFER U TO GARWY HIR:

He's the father of Indeg who is one of Arthur's mistresses, AND lover of Creirwy, daughter of Cerridwen. Now, I find the author's insinuation that the poem is specifically about Garwy Hir to be a bit of a stretch, because why tf is Ogrfan mentioned in the same breath as Garwy? They have little connection to each other in all honesty. (And I have never heard of Ogrfan, Garwy, being Cerridwen being connected.)

Well, there's a Very Prominent Lad who is connected to both of those ladies.

ARTHUR!!!!!

Husband to Gwenhwyfar, lover of Indeg. The dumbass boi himself. (Respectfully. He is just... look, a lot of Welsh sources are mixed about him. Gildas has Proper Beef with Arthur cuz he killed his brother. Also, this is the same man who called Maelgwn Gwynedd, 'a sodomitical grape.' So. He's not fuckin about.)

It sounds like - to me - this Ode could be perceived as a quest - much like his quest to Annwfn (Not outside of Hywel's subject matter. Man LOVED to intertwine war and love. Read his Gorhoffedd. You'll see what I mean.) - that's been forgotten about over the intervening centuries. One that Arthur went on to get Gwenhwyfar from her father's hall. Perhaps this is also - maybe - a far older version of the Gwenhwyfar/Guinevere and Melwas/Melegaunt myth, but idk. I cannot say for certain.

Now. You can think that this is all a bit tenuous. It very much is, I grant you. In 'The Arthur of the Welsh,' O.J. Padel suggests that Hywel is imagining himself as a suitor for Gwenhwyfar's hand (entirely fair. Right there with you, fella. I too would want to be a suitor for Gwenhwyfar.) But I think it makes a little more sense for the Ode to be Arthur.

Also, yes, I admit the reference to Gwenhwyfar is an indirect one, and I am running on 12 cups of coffee, and this didn't go anywhere, but still. It's FUN.

Now, go read about Hywel ab Owain Gwynedd, pls!!!!! His dad, Owain Gwynedd, gets compared to Cai, Cynyr, Gwalchmai, and Dillus in an elegy by Cynddelw, while his court at Gwynedd is seen to be like Arthur's at Celli Wig. (Cynddelw did a praise poem about Hywel too, which also contains lots of Arthurian references.)

Palamedes’ family in Arthuriana

Palamedes, oh, Sir Palamedes. We all know this man. Either he’s crying in front of wells or he’s on the hunt for the Questing Beast. The question is: how much do we know about his family? Some of us know that his father’s name is Esclabor and that he has a brother named Safir. In other Arthurian narratives, he has more family. As such, I did a deep dive by researching several different Arthuriana, three from the thirteenth century, one from the fifteen century, two from the sixteenth century and two from the 20th century.

The first one that we’re exploring is “Guiron le Courtois” from the Palamedes romances, written in the 13th century by an unknown author. In the narrative, around the time of the crowning of Arthur as King, the Roman emperor throws a party because his daughter got married. The emperor is brought tributes of different kinds, including people to be his slaves. A young man between 24 to 30 years old called Esclabor, his wife, several of their children (including a two-month-old Palamedes, who is named after his grandfather) and Esclabor’s brother, Arsafar, are brought from Babylon to the Roman emperor (Cadioli & Lecomte, 2021; Löseth, 1890).

It just so turns out that at that exact same moment someone attempts to kill the Roman emperor and Esclabor saves his life. More events happen, but the point is that Esclabor earns his and his family’s freedom. Esclabor asks permission to the emperor for leave so he can through Logres and then disembark at Northumberland. The emperor grants his request with much regret since he has come to consider him as a son. The family arrives safe and sound to their destination. On the way to Logres, they meet King Pellinor who is out on a hunt and he and Arsafar save his life, when two knights try to kill the king. This causes for them to have favor in King Arthur’s court (Cadioli & Lecomte, 2021; Löseth, 1890).

On the other hand, in another version of “Guiron le Courtois”, it is mentioned that Palamedes has a sister named Florine, whose lover, the Knight of the Castle of the Three Roses, died of love for her. He leaves his own eulogy carved in a marble staircase, talking of whose lover he was and for some knight to avenge him (Lathuillère, 1966).

On the other hand, in the Post-Vulgate of the “Lancelot-Grail”, written by several unknown authors in the 13th century, during the Quest for the Holy Grail, Galahad and Bors lodge at Esclabor’s home. Esclabor narrates to them that he is from the area of Galilee and as a young man he decided to travel to Britain to see and test how great the knights of the area were. He arrives during the start of Arthur’s reign. He stays in the court for a bit, everyone assuming he is a Christian. One day, they bring a beautiful young lady, whose father was a giant the knights killed (Asher, 1996).

They tell her that if she becomes a Christian, they’ll give her riches and someone to marry. She refuses, telling them that she would rather die. No one asks for her until Esclabor does to the amazement of Arthur. Arthur asks him what he is going to do with the young lady since she isn’t a Christian. Esclabor proceeds to tell the king that he’s a pagan just like the young woman and that that’s fine by him. It earns him the nickname “the Unknown” since Arthur thought he knew him, but it turns out he didn’t at all (Asher, 1996).

Esclabor and the young lady go on to marry. They have twelve sons, Palamedes being the eldest. One afternoon, during family lunch time, they all hear about the Questing Beast. Esclabor decides to hunt it down, alongside his eleven sons. Palamedes can’t make it because he’s sick at the time. The quest doesn’t well since Palamedes’ eleven younger brothers die at the hand of the Questing Beast, while Esclabor is badly wounded. This makes Palamedes swear that he’ll hunt down the Questing Beast to avenge his brothers (Asher, 1996).

Similarly, the 13th century “Prose Tristan” written by Luce de Gat and Helie de Boron, is in agreement with the Post-Vulgate in mentioning that Palamedes is the son of Esclabor and that he has eleven brothers. Moreover, he uses a black shield and wields two swords, which makes distinguishable (Curtis, 1994).

In contrast, in Thomas Malory’s “Le Morte d’Arthur” from the 15th century, Palamedes is stated to have only two brothers. Their names are Saphir and Segwarides (whose wife Tristan sleeps with, which similar with the Prose Tristan but Segwarides isn't Palamedes' brother in that narrative) (Malory, 2009).

Moreover, in the 16th century Spanish Arthuriana “Tristán de Leonís y el rey don Tristán el joven, su hijo”, Palomades (as Palamedes is called) is mentioned to have two brothers, Garacón and Separ (Safir), which coincides with Malory but the name of one of the brothers is different. In the second part, Palomades is still hung up on Iseo (Isolde) a decade or so later after she died. He sees that Iseo’s daughter of the same name resembles her mother a lot and decides to kidnap her so he can have the chance he didn’t have with her mother. A relative of “Tristán el joven” kills Palomades in order to rescue young Iseo from her captor. Naturally, Palomades’ brother Garacón appears to avenge his brother, and he gets killed (Cuesta Torre, 1997).

Then, comes Palemedes' cousin Salandro to avenge his cousins and he gets killed as well. Afterwards, Salandro's brother Amagrafo comes to avenge his brother and cousins and gets killed too. “Tristán el joven” hangs their shields and arms for exhibition as an example of what happens to those who come fight against him or something like that (Cuesta Torre, 1997).

Earlier in the same narrative, it is mentioned that Palomades is a descendant of Ebalato, whose shield belonged to “Joseph Abarimatía.” Because of the shield’s miraculous properties, Ebalato becomes a Christian. However, he’s in incarcerated for becoming a Christian and he dies in prison. His wife (whose father is called Palomades) gives birth to twins, whom she raises as Christians. However, their descendants return to their ancestors’ religion (Cuesta Torre, 1997).

Ebalato is the Spanish equivalent of Evalach, a companion of Joseph of Arimathea in the Vulgate. He is also called Evalach the Unknown, just like Esclabor is also called the Unknown later in the Post-Vulgate narration (Chase, 1993; Asher, 1996).

In addition, Evalach was gifted by Joseph of Arimathea a shield that belonged to him (Chase, 1993), which is similar to the Spanish narrative. The mention of Evalach in this narrative essentially makes Palamedes distantly related to Lancelot and Galahad since their ancestor Nascien was the brother of Sarrassinte, who was married to Evalach (Chase, 1993). The only thing that differs between narratives is the death of Evalach, since Ebalato dies in prison, while in the Vulgate Evalach dies centuries later after he meets Galahad who gets the shield of his ancestor (Cuesta Torre, 1997; Chase 1993).

Lastly, in the Vulgate, it is mentioned that Segurades has a nephew called Canagues, who was his squire (Carroll, 1993). Meanwhile, in the 16th century Portuguese Arthuriana “Memorial das Proezas da Segunda Tavola Redonda” written by Jorge Ferreira de Vasconcelos, it is mentioned that “Monsolinos de Sulfocia” is the son of Palamedes and that he uses dual swords like his father. Moreover, he has a cousin called “Leonces de Renel”(De Vasconcelos, 1867).

If all these sources are conflated together, it can be thus deduced that:

Esclabor and his wife are parents to twelve sons and one daughter. Out of the twelve sons, only four are mentioned by name which are Palamedes, Safir, Segurades and Garacón. Their daughter is Florine.

Arsafar is Escablor’s younger brother. His sons are named Salandro and Amagrafo.

Palamedes is the eldest son (or the youngest one). He has a son named Monsolinos of Suffolk.

Safir is most likely the father of Canagues, who later becomes his uncle Segurades’ squire. Meanwhile, Leonces de Renel is most likely the son of either Segurades or Garacón.

The name Palamedes is a family name, seeing as there was an ancestor named Palamedes. In turn, Esclabor’s father was named Palamedes, whose grandson was also named Palamedes as well.

Palamedes is a descendant of Evalach and Sarrassinte, sister of Nascien. That makes him a distant relative of Lancelot and Galahad who are descendants of Nascien.

References

Asher, M. (1996). The Post-Vulgate, part II: The Quest for the Holy Grail. In N. J. Lacy (Ed.), Lancelot-Grail: The Old French Arthurian Vulgate and Post-Vulgate in Translation: Vol. V (pp. 110–289). Garland Publishing, Inc.

Cadioli, L., & Lecomte, S. (2021). Il ciclo di Guiron le Courtois. Romanzi in prosa del secolo XIII. Roman de Meliadus. Parte prima. S.I.S.M.E.L. Edizioni Del Galluzzo.

Carroll, C. W. (1993). The History of the Holy Grail. In N. J. Lacy (Ed.), Lancelot-Grail: The Old French Arthurian Vulgate and Post-Vulgate in Translation: Vol. II (pp. 115–238). Garland Publishing, Inc.

Chase, C. J. (1993). The History of the Holy Grail. In N. J. Lacy (Ed.), Lancelot-Grail: The Old French Arthurian Vulgate and Post-Vulgate in Translation: Vol. I (pp. 1–163). Garland Publishing, Inc.

Cuesta Torre, M. L. (1997). Tristán de Leonís y el rey don Tristán el joven, su hijo: (Sevilla, 1534). Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México.

Curtis, R. L. (1994). The Romance of Tristan: The Thirteenth-century Old French “prose Tristan.” Oxford University Press.

Ferreira De Vasconcelos, J. (1867). Memorial das Proezas da Segunda Tavola Redonda (M. Bernardes Branco, Ed.; 2nd ed.). Typ. do Panorama.

Lathuillère, R. (1966). Guiron le courtois: Étude de la tradition manuscrite et analyse critique. Librairie Droz.

Löseth, E. (1890). Le roman en prose de Tristan, le roman de Palamède et la compilation de Rusticien de Pise: Analyse critique d’après les manuscrits de Paris (E. Bouillon, Ed.). Macon, Protat Frères, Imprimeurs.

Malory, T. (2009). Sir Thomas Malory’s Morte Darthur: A New Modern English Translation Based on the Winchester Manuscript (D. Armstrong, Ed.). Parlor Press LLC.

Arthurian characters I interpret as acespec:

Galahad, the Grail Heroine, and Bors: They generally have no apparent trouble or qualms with the eternal chastity thing (except Bors when he gets cursed, but he gets cursed).

Brangaine: In La Tavola Ritonda, she tells Gouvernail that she never wants to have sexual relationships, and in a text I haven't yet read or been able to identify, she apparently stops Kahedin from sleeping with her by using a magic pillow to make him fall asleep, a role which is Camille's in Kaherdin and Camille.

Dinadan: In LTR, they call him the Wise Man Who Does Not Love, and while he has a romantic interest in LTR, their relationship isn't sexual. To the best of my knowledge, he has no other romantic interest and no sexual relationship in all of medlit and pretty much always scorns both concepts. Usually aro, demiromantic in one text, and always ace.

Lucan: It's not anything he says or does, but unless you count the actions of Lucano the evil half-giant half-lion in LTR, he doesn't have any romantic and/or sexual relationships in any medlit I know of. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, but in my mind, he's on the aro and ace spectrums.

Happy Ace Week to all who celebrate!

Edit: I had somehow left out Dinadan, who I originally meant to include a picture of. I guess you could say he's implicit. Truly one of the aroace icons of all time. He ran so Jughead could also run.

The Superpowers of Queen Guinevere

(a compliment for my Superhuman Knights post)

Giantess/Superhuman Strength (and Size) - British Folk Myths/Welsh Lore

[....]

[....]

Sorcery/Prophecy - De Ortuu Waluuanii/Enfances Gauvain

Preternatural Hair - Knight of the Cart

Ageless Beauty - Vulgate Cycle

...so, writers, where is my Muscle Witch Rapunzel-type Queen?

Amusingly, these funfacts give a solid reason why Morgan needs something like the Green Knight to assassinate Guinevere, particularly the giantess thing from Welsh Myth: Morgan doesn't stand a chance against Guinevere face-to-face.

Bonus Attributes:

Wisdom and Graciousness

Conte du Graal/Perceval - Gawain's description

Vulgate Cycle - Merlin's description

Vulgate Cycle - Guinevere being compared to the God-blessed Grail Maiden

The Queen's Knights

(Give Gwen back her warriors!)

Lynette's family in Arthuriana

We all have heard of Lynette. We either have met her in Alfred, Lord Tennyson’s poem, “Gareth and Lynette” from the Idylls of the King, or in Le Morte d’Arthur by Sir Thomas Malory. From the mid-19th century to the present day, many works have included her either as a minor character or as the main character of her own story. As is usual, it became a curiosity of mine to find out more about her and about her family as well. In order to do so, I researched four different Arthuriana, three from the 12th century and the other one from the 15th century.

The first Arthuriana is the English one, titled “Le Morte d’Arthur” written by Sir Thomas Malory in the 15th century. In Book IV (Winchester manuscript), a damsel appears at the Pentecost feast, asking Arthur for his assistance. She withholds her identity and where she comes from. All she wants is one of Arthur’s best knights to fight for her sister who is being besieged by a tyrant.

Naturally, Arthur says no because she won’t give him more information. As we know, Beaumains (in reality, Prince Gareth of Orkney) volunteers. This pisses the damsel off because she thinks he’s a kitchen boy. During the journey, she and Beaumains clash constantly with each other. It takes them time to earn each other’s respect. It also leads for them to trust to each other. It is at Sir Persaunt of India’s city that their names to each other are revealed.

Sir Persaunt reveals her name as Lyonette (Linet in the Caxton manuscript), to which she admits it is so. Further down the text, Beaumains makes them swear not to tell anyone (which they swear not to do so) and reveals his own name.

In the end, Gareth wins against the Knight of the Red Lands, also known as Sir Ironside. He also falls in love with Lyonette’s sister, Dame Lyonesse. But she shoos him away by telling him to wait until a year later so that he gains experience and more renown. However, she changes her mind and tells her older brother, Sir Gringamore, to kidnap Gareth’s dwarf. The narrative reveals that Sir Gringamore is married. Moreover, he lives in the Isle of Avalon as it is revealed much later.

After a lot of shenanigans happen (one of them involving an undead knight), a year later Gareth marries Lyonesse. In addition, Lyonette and her niece Laurel (most probably Sir Gringamore's daughter) are married to Gaheris and Agravaine in an arranged marriage.

On the other hand, in the 12th century Arthuriana, “Érec & Énide”, written by Chretien de Troyes, Sir Gringamore, called Guigomar in the narrative, appears as a guest in the wedding of Érec and Énide. He is called the Lord of the Isle of Avalon, as well as Morgan le Fay’s “friend”. His younger brother Graislemier of Fine Posterne also appears as a guest, alongside twenty companions that came along with him.

It is of interest to mention that in another of Chrétien de Troyes’ poems, “Yvain Or The Knight Of The Lion”, Lunete mentions to her mistress, Laudine, that she got a message from her contact Demoiselle Sauvage informing her that Arthur will be coming around Laudine’s lands and she still doesn’t have anyone to defend her fountain. Similarly, in Malory, Lyonette is also called Damsel Savage as well. There is the probability that Malory took inspiration from this unnamed damsel from Chrétien de Troyes and ascribed the title to Lyonette. However, there’s not enough research that proves this possibility.

Lastly, in the First Continuation of Chrétien de Troyes’ “Perceval” written by an unknown author, Sir Gringamore makes a reappearance once more in the narrative. He’s called Guingemuer rather than Guigomar. In the story, Guerrehet (Gareth as he’s called in the narrative) avenges his half-fairy son King Brangemuer, whom he had with Queen Brangepart (a fairy). The king was named after both his parents and it is implied in the narrative that now that his mortal side is gone, he’ll still live through his fairy side of the family.

If these sources are conflated together, it can be thus concluded that:

Sir Gringamore is the Lord of the Isle of Avalon. He was at one time a lover of Morgan le Fay and he was also the lover of a fairy called Brangepart with whom he had a son called Brangemuer. He later got married and had daughter called Laurel. He’s the eldest of four siblings.

Sir Graislemier of Fine Posterne is the second brother of Sir Gringamore, and most probably lives in Avalon or in a territory adjacent to it.

Lady Lyonesse of Castle Perilous is the third sibling and youngest sister of Gringamore and the eldest sister of Lynette. She holds her own lands close to the Isle of Avalon. Moreover, she holds a magic ring that changes appearances. She married Sir Gareth of Orkney.

Lady Lynette is the youngest sister of four siblings. She's a healer, knows the magic arts, riser of the undead and wandering damsel. She’s otherwise known by Damsel Savage. She has different contacts, one of them being Lunete. She married Sir Gaheris of Orkney.

Lyonesse, Lynette and Laurel are close in age, since they married three of the Orkney brothers.

References

De Troyes, C. (2015). The complete story of the Grail: Chrétien de Troyes’ Perceval and Its Continuations (N. Bryant, Trans.). Boydell & Brewer Ltd.

De Troyes, C. (2018a). Érec & Énide (A. S. Kline, Trans.). Poetry in Translation. https://www.poetryintranslation.com/PITBR/French/DeTroyesErecEnidehome.php

De Troyes, C. (2018b). Yvain Or The Knight Of The Lion (A. S. Kline, Trans.). Poetry in Translation. https://www.poetryintranslation.com/PITBR/French/DeTroyesYvainhome.php

Malory, T. (2009). Sir Thomas Malory’s Morte Darthur: A New Modern English Translation Based on the Winchester Manuscript (D. Armstrong, Ed. & Trans.). Parlor Press LLC.

I've only messaged people on Tumblr three times: the third when I didn't have an answer for an ask (I'm still working on it), the second when I had a question to ask someone which didn't seem big enough to be ask-worthy, and the first to a very prominent Arthurian blog which wasn't strongly related to my admittedly odd and random comment about the Grail questers but was the only Arthurian blog I'd encountered at that point, since I hadn't yet figured out how Tumblr worked or that I could post things. I'm a little mortified about that last one, but all three people were nice about it. Anyway, I don't make a habit of messaging people on here because I'm worried it would seem weird and invasive. Then again, if someone messaged me, I wouldn't find it either of those things. I don't think I'm alone in this: I can vaguely remember seeing a post where someone said they would feel like they were ambushing someone in a dark alley if they messaged someone but would be happy if someone messaged them.

Anyway, all that is to say I'm not really sure how Tumblr messaging culture works, but if you want to message me, feel free to. I won't think it's weird.

An Early Documentation of the Safety Dance

Andromeda by Juan Antonio de Frías y Escalante

I'm a big fan of Madoc ap Uther, although I haven't written much about him yet. Here are some of my thoughts on him, not all of which are characterization-related but hopefully will be helpful:

He's described as "protector of happiness" (in "Madawc Drut", Marged Haycock's translation), which I find really interesting, as well as "a citadel of prowess/through feat and jest". Protector of happiness could be referring to his humor entertaining people, to his martial prowess keeping them safe, or both. (The same goes for the title itself: "drut" could mean bravery or foolhardiness but could be related to "drúth", Old Irish for jester).

Either way, it sounds like a sort of a duty, like this is something he feels obligated to do, which is obvious if he's a warrior but says a lot about his personality if he feels obligated to make jokes and keep others happy. Maybe there are some citadel walls around his inner nature and emotions; that might be a stretch in terms of literary interpretation, but potentially interesting in terms of characterization.

He seems to be very well-liked and seen as a merry fellow, but he definitely has a serious side: "before {he} was slain / he pledged himself by his hand", which is rather cryptic and suggests a sense of duty as well as a dire circumstance.

He was the son of Uther but didn't become king, so he could be Arthur's older brother who was killed before Uther died or a younger brother who didn't succeed Uther because Arthur was the eldest son (which would suggest that Arthur was raised by his biological parents). He could also be a younger brother who was the heir but was killed before Uther died (if Arthur was raised by Ector/Cynyr), but he is Eliwlod's father, so he was old enough to have children at the time of his death, which makes the last option seem less likely.

Skene's translation of "Marwnad Madawg"/"Madawc Drut" is much longer and says that he was killed by "Erof", but Haycock claims that that's the result of multiple poetic fragments which were on the same page being mashed together and that that bit is actually part of a lost poem about King Erof, AKA Herod, being dragged down to Hell. I think her translation is generally considered more reliable (and seriously doubt that Madoc was killed by King Herod, though that would be interesting).

He might be referred to as "{t}ransgressing" and "a famous leader" in a poem along with other heroes like Bran, Arthur, and Alexander the Great, but Madawg/Madog/Madoc is not a rare name. There are at least two different Madawgs mentioned in the Black Book of Carmarthen (ap Maredudd and ap Gwyn) who definitely aren't him and one who might be him but might not. As it is, the only pretty-certain references to him are "Madawc Drut" and a brief mention in Arthur's dialogue with the eagle. This is just about all the information we have to go off of, so my fondness for him comes entirely from "Madawc Drut", which is, unsurprisingly, from The Book of Taliesin.

Do we have any Madoc ap Uther/Madawg ap Uther fans out there? I'm trying to combine him with the more "continental" legends bc I think it'd be interesting but I'm wondering if anyone's written him before or has some characterization thoughts?

We should talk more about these guys. These are the guys who serve as the Literary agents of the Arthurian Romance Narrative, specifically for the Lancelot prose cycle.

Supposedly, they're the reason the stories of Lancelot, Galehaut, etc. manage to reach thw modern day. They're also how the french writers could deviate from previous material, insisting on premise they accurately recorded the happenings and deeds of the heroes not mentioned by Robert, Chretien or Geoffrey.

If you are to write an arthurian story but with your own spin and changes, you can attribute the difference to "they were totally wrong/super-biased/skewed the facts" and say "this is what really happened"

Or, more ambitiously, make up own own "source material and authorities"